Jacksons vs AEG - Day 22 – June 3 2013 – Summary
No Jackson family member was at the courthouse.
Paul Gongaware
AEG cross
Putnam asked Gongaware if MJ was comfortable with all the show dates. "Yes, I went through all of the dates with him," Gongaware said. Bugzee, the tour manager, had big calendar on the walls, Gongaware explained, saying they changed the dates of the shows four times. As to the email about changing coloring on calendar so it didn't look MJ was working too hard Putnam asked if he was trying to fool MJ. "No, I was trying to make it clear, trying to get it just the way I wanted it," Gongaware responded. (ABC7) The jury was shown an email in which Gongaware worked with a staffer to create a calendar to show Jackson. He wanted colors changed. He wanted the calendar to be changed so that it reflected Jackson's show dates and off days differently. Gongaware email: “Figure it out so it looks like he’s not working so much.” He told jury Jackson was comfortable with the show schedule. (AP)
After changing 4 show dates Gongaware said MJ was comfortable with it. He would do 8 shows in July, 10 in August, 9 in September. There would be no shows in October, November and December, resuming with 10 shows in January, 10 in February and three in March. Gongaware said the O2 Arena had previous commitment in Oct-Dec of 2009 and they could not have the MJ's concerts. (ABC7) In July 2009 there were 8 shows scheduled, 10 in August and 9 in September. Then they’d take rest of ’09 off. In Jan. and February of 2010, there were 10 shows planned per month. Three were planned in March 2010. No back-to-back shows. Gongaware said this wasn’t a rigorous schedule since there would be no traveling. On “HIStory” tour, he said they did 10-12 shows per month (AP)
Putnam: Was this a rigorous schedule? Gongaware: No, not at all. Gongaware recalled that on the HIStory tour they did 10-12 shows per month, from country to country, but this one would stay in London only. Gongaware said he wasn't concerned with MJ's age. "He seemed great to me," he said, and this was stationary show, didn't have to travel. (ABC7)
Gongaware: The reason MJ wanted to delay the 1st show was he wanted more time to rehearse in the O2 Arena where the show would take place. Gongaware said MJ and Kenny Ortega would decide the rehearsal schedule. Gongaware explained MJ didn't have to attend rehearsals, since it was not part of his deal. He said they never require an artist to rehearse. "I didn't have any expectation," Gongaware said regarding MJ rehearsing.(ABC7) Gongaware said there wasn’t a requirement for Jackson to rehearse. Said he’s never seen a requirement for musicial artist to rehearse. (AP) He said that during the HIStory tour, MJ didn't rehearse, nailed it. "When it was game time, he would show up," Gongaware explained. (ABC7) For instance, Gongaware cited an outdoor concert in Bangkok in in high heat, humidity. “He nailed it,” he said of Jackson. Gongaware: “When it was kind of game time, he was going to show up,” he said of Jackson's London shows. (AP)
As to the email Gongaware wrote about calling MJ lazy, he said he used unfortunate choices of words, Michael didn't like to rehearse. (ABC7)
Putnam: Why weren't you concerned? Gongaware: When the house lights would go up, he would show up (ABC7)
Talking about the elements of the show, Gongaware described what they wanted to do for the opening of the show. He said Michael would be dressed up in a LED suit, like a television, flashing on him brief movie about things that happened in history. Michael would be lower down onto the stage, Gongaware described. He called the LED suit a "Moon man" suit, but Ortega called it "Light man." Putnam showed a presentation of how the LED suit idea would work. Footage is not on TII documentary because it was early stages of prep. Gongaware said 1st idea was to make MJ float from the audience, but they couldn't make it work. So they decided to lower him down on stage. Gongaware said the big screen on the back of the stage was 3D capable. The audience would be given glasses when they entered the show. The 3D songs would be Thriller, Earth Song and Smooth Criminal. Email from Ortega to Gongaware saying MJ had big dreams for the shows. "He wanted to do biggest, best show ever, live show," Gongaware said. (ABC7)
Putnam showed email chain from Ortega to Gongaware asking to make a deal with choreographer Travis Payne. Answer from Gongaware: This is not AEG money, it's MJ's money so it takes a lot of time to get approvals. (ABC7)
Defendants were trying to establish a pattern that all the money spent was actually MJ's money, not AEG's, just like with Dr. Murray. (ABC7)
At one point Gongaware said he learned from MJ about doctor named Murray. "He came to me and said he wanted his personal doctor on the tour". Gongaware said he suggested to Michael to get a licensed doctor in London who would know the lay of the land, in case of need. "This is the machine, we have to take care of the machine. I want Conrad," Gongaware said Michael responded. (ABC7) “He came up to me and said he wanted to take Dr. Murray to London as his personal physician,” Paul Gongaware testified. When Gongaware suggested during the late April 2009 conversation it would be easier and cheaper to use an English doctor, Jackson vetoed the idea. Gongaware said Jackson told him, "'This is the machine. We have to take care of the machine.' I think what he meant was his brain could create it but his body had to deliver the show every night.” (LATimes)
Putnam: Were you surprised he wanted to take his doctor on tour? Gongaware: No P: Why not? G: He had doctors before. Gongaware said other artists take doctors as well, so he was not the only one and it didn't surprise him. Gongaware said he's been on tour before where an artist had chiropractors, but couldn't remember being in one with a doctor. (ABC7)
Putnam: Did you worry MJ might have a health issue? Gongaware: No P: Why not? G: He seemed fine to me, had a physical and passed. (ABC7)
Gongaware said the suggestion for London doctor was due to the cost; paying doctor full time was much more expensive than hiring local doctor. As to MJ asking to take care of the machine, Gongaware said he understood it to be that every night MJ would have to do be ready to perform. Gongaware said Dr. Murray treated MJ for about three years before 2009. He knew the doctor was from Las Vegas but said he was in LA. Gongaware said he then called Dr. Murray to work out a deal. Gongaware testified he didn't have MJ's direct phone number, would go through Michael Amir Williams, MJ's personal assistant, to reach him. Gongaware called Murray on behalf of MJ saying singer wanted to take him to London. "What do you want to be paid for that," Gongaware asked. Gongaware said he thought Dr. Murray was expecting his call and was aware of MJ's desire to take him on tour. "He said he would need $5 million," Gongaware recalled. "He said he has 4 clinics to close, would lay off people, need $5 million for that." "It was ridiculous," Gongaware said about the amount asked. "It was a lot of money for something like that and Michael could not afford it." Gongaware said he responded that it wasn't going to work. (ABC7) “I asked him what he wanted." Gongaware testified. "He said he’d need $5 million." Murray told Gongaware that he'd have to shut down his clinics in Houston, Las Vegas and San Diego and lay people off. Asked by AEG attorney Marvin Putnam if Murray's price was reasonable, Gongaware replied, “It was ridiculous… Michael couldn’t afford it, so I had to tell him it wasn’t going to work.” (LATimes) He said this was the first time he spoke with Dr. Murray. After that, Gongaware said he told Michael Amir and Randy Phillips what the doctor had asked. He also told Frank DiLeo. Putnam: Would you be doing this if Michael had not asked you? Gongaware: No . (ABC7)
Putnam: Did you contemplate bringing a doctor on tour? Gongaware: I didn't think he needed one, we didn't have one in History, he was fine. (ABC7)
Gongaware said he called Michael Amir Williams to report back to MJ what the doctor had asked to go on tour. "We couldn't afford it," Gongaware said. He spoke with Phillips and called Frank DiLeo, MJ's manager at the time. Gongaware said a lot of people who wanted to work for MJ asked for huge sums of money, thinking he had a lot. (ABC7)
"He was Michael's doctor, Michael wanted him. That was it," Gongaware said. (ABC7)
Putnam: Did you think about checking the doctor?
Gongaware: No
P: Why not?
G: He was Michael's doctor (ABC7)
" I'm not going to tell Michael Jackson who his doctor should be," Gongaware explained. (ABC7) "It wasn't my place to say who his doctor was going to be," Gongaware said. "It was his decision." (AP)
Gongaware said he doesn't think a doctor's financial situation has anything to do with being an ethical doctor. Gongaware said it never crossed his mind to either do a background check on Dr. Murray or to suggest to anyone to do it. "I just expect doctors to be ethical, the financial side of their lives shouldn't have impact on their medical decision," Gongaware opined. (ABC7) Paul Gongaware testified that he didn't think it was necessary to conduct background checks on anyone working closely with Jackson. He said in Conrad Murray's case, he wasn't concerned about his background because he'd been recommended by the entertainer. "I just expect doctors to be ethical," Gongaware said. "Their financial side of their life shouldn't affect their medical judgment." (AP)
Gongaware said he never did background check on anyone he hired and had he done one on Dr. Murray, it would've been out of the ordinary. (ABC7)
He also said he never considered performing background checks on Jackson's makeup artist, a choreographer who worked one-on-one with the singer or Kenny Ortega, the tour's director. "I didn't see the need for it," he said. (AP)
As how MJ was, Gongaware said he was great. He didn't think he had relapsed, was using painkillers again and said MJ had always been thin. "It wasn't surprising he wanted a doctor," Gongaware expressed. (ABC7)
Dr. Finkelstein, a friend of Gongaware, said a doctor should charge $10,000 a month for the tour work. But Dr. Finkelstein would've done it for free, since he was on the Dangerous tour before and had a lot of fun.(ABC7)
The second call about Dr. Murray came from Michael Amir Williams saying they were going to need to get a deal done for the doctor. Gongaware said he heard MJ in the car saying "offer 150, offer 150." Gongaware understood that to be $150k/month. Gongaware called Dr. Murray, said he was authorized to offer him $150k a month. He said Dr. Murray responded that he couldn't do it for that. Gongaware told him the offer came directly from the artist and Dr. Murray responded: I'll take it. Gongaware said Michael approved the amount of compensation. "Michael told me offer 150," Gongaware recalled. "And that's what I did." Gongaware inquired Dr. Murray how he would get a license in London and the doctor told him not to worry about it. They talked about Dr. Murray's request for a house in London, and the doctor said he would need a three bedroom house. Gongaware recalled Dr. Murray saying he would probably need an assistant and some equipment, but no details were given at this point. After the call, Gongaware said he let Michael Amir Williams know what the result was in an email. "Done at 150k per month, per MJ." Gongaware said this was a message for MJ, that he had done what he asked. He didn't receive any response back from Michael Amir Williams. (ABC7) Gongaware wrote a May 6, 2009, email to Jackson's assistant after cutting the deal with Murray: “done at $150k per month, per MJ. He needs about 10 days to wind down his practice then he will be full time.” Gongaware said the email was a message to Jackson "that I had done what he asked." (LAtimes)
Asked why he had negotiated with Murray, the AEG executive replied that he was "instructed to by Michael Jackson." Gongaware said there was no other reason for him to deal with the doctor. Marvin Putnam asked Gongaware why he didn't tell Jackson he couldn't take Murray on tour with him."Because he could if he wanted," Gongaware said. (LAtimes)
Gongaware said he passed Dr. Murray on to Timm Wooley, never had any other conversation with Dr. Murray about him possibly going to London. Putnam: Do you have any understanding as to whether a contract with Dr. Murray was executed?
Gongaware: One never was
Putnam: Did AEG pay Dr. Murray any kind of money?
Gongaware: No (ABC7)
Gongaware said MJ was ultimately responsible for his own health: "I think everyone is responsible for their own health and well being." MJ was a grown man with capability to make decisions regarding his health and medical care, Gongaware explained. (ABC7)
Putnam showed Gongaware a frame from “This Is It” film in which Jackson’s manager, Frank Dileo, was sitting in on dancer auditions. (AP) Dancers auditions took place at the Nokia Theater on April 13, 14, 15. MJ attended the last day and made the final decision, Gongaware said. Putnam played a clip of the dancers audition. Gongaware said MJ was very involved and chose the dancers. Gongaware said Ortega wanted to film the audition to use fresh footage on http://michaeljacksonlive.com. The cost for crew to shoot the audition was very high, so Gongaware bought couple of cameras and use his own crew to shoot the rehearsals. He said he wasn't sure what he would use the video for, but thought the website would be a good platform. (ABC7)
Gongaware said during the period at Center Staging, MJ was good, engaging, didn't think MJ had any health issues or was using drugs. (ABC7)
Gongaware said the media in the UK was going wild with gossip about Michael Jackson. "They just lie about things.". The Sun claimed MJ had skin cancer on his chest. "It was sport over in London," Gongaware said about MJ's stories on tabloids.(ABC7) Gongaware testified about emails in which UK press agents working on “This Is It” sent him tabloid reports on MJ’s health. Gongaware said he urged the press agents not to respond. He wanted Jackson’s performance to speak for itself & silence skeptics. (AP)
Gongaware was shown emails he was sent less than a month before Jackson's death in which tabloid newspapers were speculating the singer was suffering from cancer.
Gongaware urged his company not to respond. "Our redemption will be when he does his shows," he wrote about Jackson. "We don't have to sell tickets, so we can just sit back and prove them wrong by just doing it." (AP)
Gongaware on 5/27/09:
The Kid is healthy and rehearsing every day. He was still there at dance rehearsals at 9pm last night when I left. Our redemption will be when he does his shows, that makes all of this build up so damn sweet. We don't have to sell tickets, so we can just sit back and prove them wrong by just doing it. (ABC7)
Gongaware said he was not concerned. "If there was something going on, if he had cancer, we would've heard about it." He said if the rumor about the cancer were true, they would've to deal with a lot to accommodate the shows. Gongaware said while they were rehearsing at Center Staging, he was not concerned with MJ's health. (ABC7)
Michael Jackson rehearsal venues: Mar 28- Center Staging, May 27- Forum ,June 23 - Staples Center , July 13 - O2 Arena (ABC7)
Putnam also asked Gongaware about an incident Karen Faye testified about, that she heard PG yelling at MJ's assistant one day. The incident occurred while "This Is It" rehearsals were happening at The Forum in LA. Faye claimed she heard Gongaware yelling about Jackson being late to a rehearsal and told his assistant to get him there. "Never, never happened," Gongaware said, shaking his head. (AP) Gongaware said he never told security guard to get MJ to rehearsals, whatever it takes. He said he never told anyone to get MJ 2 rehearsals. (ABC7)
Putnam went through chain of email about tabloid reports in the UK regarding MJ. In one, it said MJ had asked AEG to reduce the number of shows by half. Gongaware said that such a discussion never happened. Gongaware testified he woke up to one gossip headline pretty much every day. His idea was simply to ignore the tabloids. An amazing show would be the answer, Gongaware said. (ABC7)
Gongaware: “With MJ we don’t’ have to react to the press. We can decide what we want to do and then do it.” His email continued laying out his strategy: “We can only make this work, of course, if MJ puts on the best show of his life.” Gongaware: “I’m here to tell you that he will. I have seen it for myself,” he said of Jackson's performances. He described a rehearsal in which MJ performed 9 songs. Gongaware: “He was amazing, captivating, riveting. And he’s just getting started.” (AP)
Gongaware on 6/5/09 in response to Sunday Mirror Query: "We can only make this work, of course, if MJ puts on the best show of his life. I'm here to tell you that be will. I have seen it for myself. Last night he ran 9 songs with full band, singers and dancers. Sang every one, he was amazing, captivating, riveting. And he's just getting started. Taking it one step further. When people realize that bulls**t the press has been, they will be in receptive mood for the truth Hey look. No skin cancer. He's just a good dad, loving raising his kids. His art and his craft are paramount. Email cont'd: A gentile, loving man who does care about people. (ABC7)
"The shows were going to be spectacular," Gongaware said. Putnam showed clip of MJ in front of green screen with 11 dancers, who would become 11,000. Gongaware said MJ was great at this point. (ABC7)
Gongaware was shown some “This Is It” film footage. He denied any footage was taken out or altered. He was asked about CEO Randy Phillips’ email where he described Jackson in a red leather jacket and looking like a skeleton. Clip from “Thriller” mini-movie shoot for “This Is It” was played for jury, and Jackson was there, wearing red leather jacket. He denied that “This Is It” feature film presented a skewed vision of Michael Jackson. (AP)
Regarding email Phillips sent Gongaware directing to remove MJ's "skeletal" scenes Gongaware said he didn't take anything out of the movie.
Putnam: Did you remove anything from the movie?
Gongaware: No (ABC7)
Putnam showed clip from TII with making of Thriller 3D and Jackson wearing red jacket.
Putnam: Did you try to alter in anyway how Mr. Jackson looked, appeared?
Gongaware: No
Gongaware said he didn't remember any of the footage been removed because of how MJ looked. "We just let the footage speak for itself." (ABC7)
The mini-movie of "Earth" a bulldozer would come out from a ramp in center stage. Putnam: A real bulldozer?
Gongaware: I wish, it would've been cheaper, but it would have crushed our ramps. Gongaware said they had to build the bulldozer like a prop. It would appear at the end of the song on stage. "I think the live audience would be just captivated by it," Gongaware said about the little girl running after the last plant on Earth song. (ABC7)
End of the show would be 3D animation. An airplane taxis up, door opens, Michael entered the plane. The airplane door closes, MJ would actually take an elevator down and out of the building, but plane would take off over the audience. (ABC7)
Gongaware said he didn't know if anyone was responsible for MJ's nourishment. Tour would be demanding and exhausting. (ABC7)
Gongaware said he met Dr. Murray once at MJ's Carolwood house and ran into him at The Forum during rehearsal. There was a meeting scheduled to discuss MJ's nutrition with Randy Phillips, Kenny Ortega, Dr. Murray, MJ, Gongaware and DiLeo.
Putnam: Do you recall anyone in that meeting ever tell Dr. Murray how he should be treating MJ?
Gongaware: No (ABC7)
Gongaware said he didn’t have any medical training and wasn’t qualified to tell Conrad Murray how to treat Jackson. (AP)
Gongaware said neither Dr. Murray nor MJ talked about the treatment singer was receiving. The meeting was about nutrition, vitamin, therapy. Gongaware said he had no idea Dr. Murray was giving MJ Propofol and first heard of the anesthetic after Michael died. Gongaware said Dr. Murray was really engaged in the meeting, seemed like a very intelligent guy and wanted to take care of MJ very much. This was the first time Gongaware had with Dr. Murray. He said there were no signs of MJ being poorly treated by the doctor. "Michael was engaged in the meeting, attentive, seemed happy we were having this meeting," Gongaware opined. "He's a doctor, he'd know better than anybody how to treat his patient," Gongaware said about Dr. Murray. Gongaware said he was never present on any meeting where anyone told Dr. Murray how to treat MJ. (ABC7)
As to Gongaware's email saying AEG, not MJ, paid Dr Murray he said he mistaken. "We wouldn't pay his salary, we'd advance Michael's money". Gongaware said he didn't remember writing/receiving the email, but never denied he did it. "Michael Jackson would be paying his salary, but AEG would advance the money," Gongaware testified. (ABC7)
As to MJ being habitual late, Gongaware said the singer worked on his own schedule, did things his way. (ABC7)
Gongaware said his understanding was that MJ hired a trainer of his choice, Louis (Lou) Ferrigno. "I made the deal with him (Ferrigno). He was supposed to be paid certain amount of money per session," Gongaware said. (ABC7) Paul Gongaware said Ferrigno was working with Jackson as a trainer. He said he negotiated Ferrigno’s deal. Gongaware: “He was to be paid ... a certain amount, per session.” He didn’t elaborate on fee, how many times he worked with MJ. (AP) Putnam showed email from Travis Payne, he suggested massage chair 2 be put in MJ's dressing room. Gongaware said it wasn't callous treatment. (ABC7)
As to Bugzee's email saying MJ needed cheeseburgers, brats and beers, Gongaware said Bugzee was joking, Bugzee cared very much for MJ. Gongaware testified he didn't recall having any concern about MJ's health/using painkillers as of Monday 6/15/09, 10 days prior to his death. (ABC7)
Gongaware was asked about several emails that have been shown before, including messages related to MJ missing rehearsal on June 19, 2009. The executive was on the East Coast for a family wedding, but responded to one message questioning why Murray wasn’t at rehearsal. Gongaware email: “Take the doctor with you. Why wasn’t he there last night?” He then explained his thinking to the jury. Gongaware: “If his patient is having is problem and he’s sick, and he’s his only patient, it seemed like he should be there.” (AP) Gongaware said on 6/19/09, he was out of town. "This is the day Michael had chills at rehearsal and was apparently sick," Gongaware recalled. "If the meeting was going to be about what happened that night, the doctor should be there," Gongaware said. Gongaware: If his patient is sick and he's your only patient, doctor should be there! (ABC7)
Gongaware said he believed MJ wanted to go on tour. He said he doesn't remember anyone talking about pulling the plug on the shows. (ABC7)
Putnam: Did anyone tell you at this point that MJ needed a drug addiction specialist?
Gongaware: No
Putnam: Did anyone tell you they were concerned with the care Dr. Murray was giving to MJ?
Gongaware: No (ABC7)
Gongaware said that on 6/20/09 he did not think MJ's health was deteriorating. Gongaware and Phillips were concerned with MJ's well being. (ABC7) With last questions of the day, AEG attorney Marvin Putnam asked Gongaware if he was concerned about Jackson’s well-being. He said yes. (AP)